Korean Women, Part 1: Dating and Body Image (updated)
(Photo by 台北BoA)
Introduction
Today’s post is inspired by the journal article ”Content Analysis of Diet Advertisements: A Cross-National Comparison of Korean and U.S. Women’s Magazines” by Minjeong Kim and Sharron Lennon (Clothing and Textiles Research Journal, October 2006), which interested readers can download for themselves here if they want.
I found it myself while I was doing research for my recent posts on Korean women’s body images and consumerism, and unlike the article(s) I discuss there, that free access means that here I can concentrate on giving my opinions of the article and adding related things not covered in it, rather than simply rehashing much of its content like I normally have to. Hence I say “inspired by” and not “about,” and although the article is an easy, 20-minute read tops, you don’t have to read it to enjoy this post or the other two or three in the series.
Still, I think I can at least impose on you to read the abstract, so you know what to expect:
Content analysis of diet advertisements was performed to examine how diet advertisements portray the Western ideal of feminine beauty and promote dieting in Korean women’s magazines in comparison with U.S. women’s magazines. Results showed that the Western cultural ideal of feminine beauty and dieting were prevalent in Korean women’s magazines. Diet advertisements in Korean magazines appear to promote more passive dieting methods (e.g., diet pills, aroma therapy, diet crème, or diet drinks) than active dieting methods (e.g., exercise). Results further indicated that women may be misled to believe that dieting is simple, easy, quick, and effective without pain, if they consume the advertised product. This study suggests that there is an urgent need to establish government regulations or policies about diet products and their claims in Korea. Magazine publishers also need to recognize their role in societal well-being and accept some responsibility for advertisements in their magazines.
Yep, it’s another “girly” subject, which got me thinking: online, I often get accused of being a woman, and while I couldn’t care less really, a new reader to the blog could be forgiven for thinking that I am a woman given this and recent subjects. What can I say? I like women, and unfortunately I can’t say much more than that without giving the impression that I do actually care (damn). But by coincidence, the first thing I thought of when I read that journal article is something probably every expat guy in Korea can relate to, and it just goes to show how the ostensibly girly subjects on my blog have much more of a universal appeal than they may at first appear.
You’re Not Fat, Dammit!
(Photo by KimchiSugar)
Teaching children rather than adults, and being married and a father now, then I don’t have time to often meet new Korean women these days. But when I did, I was always amazed at how readily many would mention to me that they thought were fat and needed to lose weight. Sure, not immediately, but soon enough into our relationship (professional, platonic or otherwise) to be noticeable. Especially if they were in their early-20s too, and always virtually regardless of their actual weight and body shape or size.
Back when I was single, I would find that dates and/or semi-girlfriends often would too. Naturally, if that happened today I’d probably call it a night right there and then, but the first few times it happened, I’d feel like offering a quiet prayer of thanks for the opportunity offered: surely the very first guy to compliment her about her body, after a lifetime of criticism about her weight from relatives, friends and Korean men, would reap the rewards of making her feel good about herself? It sounds very calculating on my part, and was, but that is the nature of dating. And for obvious reasons, I wasn’t actually lying when I did it.
But…sigh…how young and naive I was. Thirty minutes and numerous repeated compliments later I’d still be nowhere, and, exasperated, would be well into covering the facts that:
- Regardless of what she was aiming for, all men’s instinctive preference is for women with a 0.7 waist to hip ratio. Although, hell, a good 99.99% or so of sexual encounters are done for pleasure rather than reproduction, males and females still find the most fertile mates the most attractive. And women with hourglass figures just so happen to be 30% more fertile than the androgynous figures favoured by many Koreans.
(Detail from Bouguereau’s The Birth of Venus.)
- Women’s ovaries don’t work below 18% body fat: see page 347 of the article for more, and come to think of it it’s even mentioned in G.I. Jane too. Sure, not all women are blessed with the most fertile body form, actually the vast majority aren’t, but that doesn’t mean that our base, uncouth male reproductive instincts don’t only respond to a woman of any form that can actually get pregnant.
It’s no exaggeration to say that I wouldn’t have to walk very far from my apartment to see many extremely thin, immaculately dressed and make-uped(?) women at the height of Korean ideals of beauty, but which for the life of me I could never imagine having a sexual relationship with. To be precise, they remind me of a Garfield cartoon where he pours water on a poodle to reveal that it’s really just eyeballs and hair, and I too simply can’t image that under the make-up and clothes of the women I describe, that there’s someone with even the physical constitution to have and enjoy sex, let alone of having a child. And so I strongly suspect that, if they’re in a relationship, that they don’t have sex, and in some cases are surely no more than trophy girlfriends for their male partners to show off.
(Photo by A4 Sirphoto)
Certainly, much the same can be said of many women and relationships in Western countries too, but there it’s increasingly difficult not to hear about the distinction between real life and the ideals of beauty represented by the fashion industry. Even the fashion industry itself has begun to respond to that in recent years, and women’s magazines have paid more than lip-service to it for decades too, although articles about healthy body images will often still literally be alongside advertisements with ultra-thin models. But in Korea, there is no distinction, and in hindsight that follows on from fashion for conformity’s sake that I discussed in earlier posts. It’s also something that I think someone has to have Korean ability and/or be in Korea to appreciate, because image searches of Korean women on English-language sites like Google or Flickr and so on, for instance, tend to reveal healthy-looking women in line with English-speaking users’ tastes and photographic interests. They don’t capture just how skinny and how so many ordinary, apparently non-photogenic Korean women have become in pursuit of the thin ideal.
And hence all the above both contributes to and despite fact 3, which is that:
- Korean women are the amongst the least obese in the world. Now, I’m from a Western country (three in fact), so with that background and her own, not unreasonable, stereotypes of Western women, did she really think that I’d find her obese? I had hair then, and wasn’t that ugly…did she think I’d scraped the bottom of the barrel with her or something…?
All very romantic I know, but then I’ve long since moved on from what I actually said on those dates (sorry). But I’m not exaggerating when I say that I married the first Korean woman with healthy curves that not once mentioned that she thought she was too fat to me. And I’m speaking literally: when I say “healthy curves”, I don’t mean them in the euphemistic sense that Westerners are used to, and when I say that she never said that she was too fat to me, I mean that she…well, never said that she was too fat. I don’t mean that she was “confident” with her body, and there is a difference: because of the contexts in which it’s used, I think to most Westerners that that phrase conjures up an image of a sexually-aggressive women flaunting herself in a crop-top for instance, and, not that I’m against that, but that was out of question in rural Korea in 2000. But she did never wear a t-shirt over her swimsuit at the beach, and although it may be difficult to believe now, that was quite daring back then.
Bikini Feminism
To illustrate what I mean, consider the following photos. The first two are now normal sights on Korean beaches, and I’m perfectly serious when I say that this fact is to be applauded. I won’t pretend that I don’t mean that in my male, voyeuristic sense, but I also mean it in a feminist sense too:
(Photo by Jeremy Chae)
(Photo by Jeremy Chae)
Claiming that bikinis are good for feminism possibly - hell, probably - sounds patronising and facetious to many female readers. But then consider this picture, which from experience was the norm on Korean beaches in 2000:
(Photo by model337)
Yes, the woman on the left is indeed wearing a bikini, but is that make-up on her face too? And I can’t imagine that the women on the right wouldn’t prefer not be dragged down by the weight of their heavy t-shirts, but are only wearing them because of embarrassment. So when I say that my wife was the first attractive Korean woman I’d met who was simply comfortable with her body, and that that was very refreshing after my previous dating experiences here, then hopefully you can appreciate how much more meaningful that statement is then maybe it first appears.
And in hindsight, it was so telling of Korea too. Because that was despite her being “fatter” than most of her then friends, and that those friends reminded her of that seemingly every time they met. That she still hung out with them despite that - at least until I convinced her otherwise - now makes me realise how routine this perception of themselves must be for many Korean women, although I already suspected because of how little I’d been able to change the minds of those women I dated before I met her. They would nod dutifully at my verbal barrage, and some would even be surprised and interested, but I still had a gut feeling that I what I’d said hadn’t and would never ultimately make any difference to their body images.
I suspect that while my arguments may have been better received if they’d been made by a woman, it would have taken a Korean woman to ultimately convince them. In a sense, what I was saying was a criticism of Korea in that I was criticising a concept of women’s beauty that many if not most Korean women and men subscribe to, even if it isn’t actually Korean per se. And unfortunately, it’s a fact of life here that all too many Koreans will give little credence to something only said by foreigners, regardless of its objective reliability.
(Photo by publish9)
Or is it? Does all the above still apply? Those dates were back in rural, conservative Jinju in 2000, not quite the same place as Seoul in 2008. Does this still happen on dates with Korean women? Do Korean women still constantly moan about being fat with their friends, Western and/or Korean? Could a picture like the above be taken in a nightclub outside of Seoul? These are all questions I’d like to pose to readers.
Nobody will believe me because I’m still not up to the “diet” in my post’s title, but nevertheless I really didn’t start this post planning to make it a series! But I’ve decided to break it up because of the length and especially those questions above. As you can guess, I haven’t been on a date in 8 years, and so while I’m loath to admit it - I am a longtimer and Korea-Studies geek after all - someone who’s been here a grand total of say, 8 weeks may well know more about the Korean dating scene than I do. So I really would appreciate feedback before moving on to Part 2.
Update: If you’ve read this far, then you’ll probably like this related recent post at Korea Beat too.
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Interesting that you write about this subject because I have a Korean girlfriend who’s only been in the US for about two years and she is this exact same way. She’s absolutely NOT FAT and she has a great body but it’s like talking to a brick wall when I tell her she’s not fat and that’s she’s beautiful. Apparently she was much thinner before she came to the US and now she’s gained some weight. But even considering that, by anyone’s standards, she’s still NOT FAT.
Anyway it’s good to find out that it’s a normal thing for a Korean girl to do. But it’s troubling to find out that being a brick wall is normal too.
I’ve been here a few years, dating somewhat frequently. While I have met a few girls that talk about their body image, there was an acquaintance that always complained that she was fat, which was probably only because she had wider than normal hips; but not fat by any means. After telling her time and again that she wasn’t, I met that brick wall that you mention.
Then I realized I would just agree with her, and make fun of her in a playful way. I figure, since they’re convinced of being fat anyway and it doesn’t matter what we say, might as well agree with them and exaggerate it, have fun with it. Like “I’m fat” “Yea you are, stop eating” lol! But done in a way that they know you’re not serious.
People tell me a lot that I’m too thin and that I need to put weight on….probably, I’m what these women aspire to be…
Thanks for the comments guys. Even your’s too daeguowl, it’s good to see some life from you after such a long break on your blog.
Chris, I strongly suspect that where Korean women grow up as teenagers makes all the difference. Here, it’s perfectly acceptable and normal for teachers to tell their students that they’re too fat, or even berate them for it, whereas I’m pretty certain that would mean instant dismissal in the US, right?
Jon, I hear you, and I’ve done the playful/flirting thing over it too. But had that ever led to something, it would have been quite a stumbling block, because although it was often said playfully by the women I talk about it was usually sincerely meant. And I don’t think I could have a relationship with someone with such negative images of themselves but ironically also obession about it too.
Well, my fiancée isn’t fat but she (like me) has gained weight, so whatever I say about “you’re not! fat!” doesn’t work. But she also thinks the rail-thin look is nothing to pursue.
I agree with the idea this has to do with where one had grown up, and the environment that permits put-downs is likelier to produce people with negative self-images and obsessions to match.
Then again, I find that put-downs — especially of women — are not seen as anti-social to anywhere near the same degree as they are in Western society. (Which is interesting, since it resembles what some female writers describe as having been horrifyingly acceptable in the 50s, 60s, or even the 70s.) I know it took me a while to not be shocked every time a male college student told a female one she was ugly or fat or should put on makeup or dress in some way other than she was dressed, and students always seemed to think it odd when I stopped this sort of thing and warned the guy that he was expected to be respectful of all his classmates in my classroom.
(I saw that a lot more in the countryside, but still see it done occasionally by the inarticulate boys who seem not to belong in university and are at the bottom of the class. They’re probably just trying to compensate for the fact their targets are outperforming them academically, intellectually, and otherwise. But what’s odd is that their acting out so rarely provokes a response or rebuke. One cannot help but wonder what the average, older Korean professor says in such situations.)
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Gord, come to think of it, I’ve never had adults putting each other down in my classes, although I have have had my fair share of equally sexist, racist, and just darn crazy opinions from students, especially in my first year. By coincidence, I picked up the book Discussions that work by Penny Ur after that, and from then on I almost exclusively gave task-based activities in my adult classes. Worked like a charm, both for my sanity and their learning.
Your comment about skinny, beautiful women not being able to have sex or enjoy it is a little over the top. Are you serious? Other than that gripe, I find your observations and opinions very smart and interesting…
Kevin, thanks for your comments, and yes, possibly my remark about skinny women is a little over the top. But to be precise, I said that I couldn’t imagine that they were able to rather than saying that they weren’t, and that probably reveals more about my own preconceptions, tastes, and experiences more than anything about Korean women themselves. Still, I’d think exactly the same if I came across a 6ft, normally-proportioned Western man and a rake-thin Western woman…and there do seem to be a lot of Korean couples like that!
James,
I think you’re on to something. And to be fair, I guess find myself having similar thoughts when I look at a super-skinny, make-up and designer clothes clad young woman strutting her way down the street…Although skinny has less to do with it than the overall self-presentation.
What I perceive in many of these women (and men for that matter) is someone who can probably go through the motions of sex just fine, perhaps even reaching orgasm, but who cannot be intimate or achieve happiness through intimacy. This is someone who probably does not feel joy from simply being held and told that they are loved. This is someone who desires so much to be seen that they have lost connection with the unseen world, which of course is the world where love resides.
In other words, I feel that those who really go overboard in attaining the look are really rejecting other people in the process. Their desire to place themselves above, or outside of, the rest of society ultimately makes them lonely…perhaps in a way this behavior is sociopathic.
The more I think about it however, the more I feel that people are more frequently pushed into this kind of behavior than enter into it as a conscious choice.
well i’m asian american so i’m probably not “korean” enough to write my opinion here but i AM obsessed with body image, weight, and racial identity so i feel like writing anyway.
i have always felt deep inside i was too big, too ugly and too americanized to be accepted by other asians. i’m usually careful to avoid speaking of these topics as i know i’d sound crazy, racist, attention seeking, self pitying, superficial, ect…despite this sensibility, i still have difficulty coming to terms with my negative body image. at 5′4″ and 96 lbs, i wear the mask of a stylish, cute young woman from an asian magazine. inside i still feel like the shy, nerdy teenage girl who was told she was chubby, plain, clumsy and foolish at 115lbs.
my fiance is caucasian and over twice my size. he is always telling me how petite, beautiful, and clever i am and my brick wall has been gradually crumbling. every now and then he surprises me with a compliment so genuine, that i stop replaying those old criticizing voices in my head. this year i turned 28 and for the first time in my life, i wore a bikini. i didn’t cover up in a baggy t-shirt or towel. i still crossed my arms over my stomach when i sat down and averted my eyes from making any human contact, but i’ll be working on that.
Jen, thanks, and anyone’s more than welcome to leave a comment! Sorry that I didn’t reply to it earlier.
I wouldn’t feel so bad about taking so long to get over your negative body image. It’s quite normal. It’s very easy for me personally to laugh at and feel superior to Koreans for, say, getting cosmetic surgery, especially on a blog, but then I recall that for most of my twenties that whenever I felt depressed then I just needed to get a haircut to feel better…in other words, my depression was solely due to my not liking how my hair looked.
Now at 32, I don’t even have much hair, but if I go more than 3 days without shaving it then I don’t feel sexy, confident, and will just want to avoid human contact as much as possible, even though my hair is so short that most people wouldn’t ever notice the difference.
So no matter how I may sound on the blog, I’m by no means over linking my confidence to my appearance myself, and also still have to work on it. So like I said, don’t feel too bad about it!
Stayed in Ulsan, Korea for 3 weeks now. I’ve found this post very interesting, as I’ve been trying to make sense of cultural perceptions and expectations of beauty since I arrived.
My sense is there is a strong Western preoccupation, particularly among women. I’ve also noticed Korean TV sometimes tries too hard to emulate American shows, becoming almost contrived and artificial.
Regarding your observations of Korean women - the women I see in the streets and in classes seem to come in all sizes. To be honest I’ve had me out for a thin (forgive me, I’m western), pretty one who speaks English. But I have seen few, if any. Maybe I’m not going to the right places, but from my short stay here I have yet to see the “thin” female stereotype on a large scale.
I’ll stop rambling. Keep writing James!
Hi, I found this blog by accident. I just recently got into the hallyu wave. I’ve been watching some Korean dramas. I also TAed for a class on politics of east asia. I guess that’s beside the point. I would say that what I’ve seen from Korean students in the US, there is a strong desire to be acculturated within the US culture. The Korean girls in my class were not what I would qualify ‘thin’ per say but the ones I saw on campus were sometimes ‘thin.’ As a female international student in the US, this topic seems very interesting. But I guess even those ‘thin’ Korean girls could be nice people. Ah well, this is my two cents.